As Anticipated, It's "Anywhere but Ohio"

I seem to recall 2 (maybe 3 sites) in Ohio, word on the street at the time has it Tom Acklin drove up on one of them, never got out of the car and determined it would not work ... The offer from Texas was for ownership with low or no interest money, Indiana had the dual trapline, and Illinois wanted to build a money pit ($22,000,000 plus) to get rid of excess Tax dollars so they can warrant a tax increase again ... I am not in the mix, do not know why the Ohio sites never made the minutes but do seem to recall people talking about them at the time ... I recall LasVegas was in the mix but not an immediate remedy which is what the ATA was interested in ... That was then, this is now ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

Where in Indiana?

How does a dual trapline work?

 

They build a trapline, then a berm out about 100/150 (?) yards and the another trapline in front of that ... Not sure of the distance but legal shotshells would be exhausted (beyond) the point where the berm would be ... Not the best idea in town but could be made to work if there was no other choice ... Ben Avery has talked about such a set up the past few years not sure if it has ever become reality or not ... I have to take a ride up there and check it out ... Car Shows, Doctor appoinments etc get in the way of a lot of things ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

There were 4 locations in Ohio offered, best offer was from Lex Wexner near London Ohio, w/ traps facing north, and a 99 year lease, Wexner Controlled, ATA is n.

2nd Location was west of Vandalia Land offered by Dayton, Ohio/Airport exchange of lands, If I am right approx. less than 3 miles. Relocation Committee turned it down.

3rd Location was Eartern Ohio on Ohio Power/Reclamation Lands near McConnelsville, Ohio
ATA Pres. Tom Acklin would not get out of car/ and the Corporate Officers that controlled the land were there, and stood up by ACKLIN, he ignored them.

4th location, please help me on this one, Acklin refused to accept that location to relocation committee.

The relocation committee I feel were prejudiced/ and influenced by some means/possible lands ownership fattening someones investment wallets in the ATA.

Gary Bryant Dr.longshot

 

They have multiple trap lines at San Antonio, upper and lower levels

The first Dixie Grand had trap lines facing each other almost all had Skeet Fields on them
I know I shot there, I spent part of my Honeymoon shooting there. I loved the local Seafood and the Flag Waving Lady Statue, in the Harbor. That Seafood Chowder was to die for.

Gary Bryant Dr.longshot

 

If August is the problem just start the ATA year with 1Jan. Then the problem disappers.

 

Wasn't Tom Acklin the ATA president from OHIO?

Sounds like he was instrumental in making sure the Grand left Ohio.

 

Yeah......I hear he got a 50K gun out of the deal and became ATA president. No one saw that coming.

 

London, OH would be a great location.

West of Vandalia would be a good location.

I'm not the biggest fan of Eastern Ohio. Too hilly. Too inaccessible. Too hard to build. For me, Ohio ends at Buckeye Lake. McConnelsville is a rough ride to get to. It's socked in the middle of a massive dissected plateau.

London is the best of the options you listed.

 

I heard they cannot find his gun

 

The last site was supposedly The Revenna Arsenal east of Akron, Ohio

 

These sites were offered in a written proposal?

 

Leon, yes, he wanted the Indianapolis dual line deal to go through.

A young man from Northwest Ohio bought his gun I heard.

AZCOTRAP, no, those deals weren't in written form from what I heard. Most were merely told they weren't interested in their proposals, that, without knowing all the details. So no, no paper trails left behind that I've heard of. Does that make it right or ridiculous?

HAP

 

Who knows if the proposals were as you describe "written" but the sites were proposed just the fact that ATA EC went to look at them is enough to warrant that there were other proposals to the ATA for a Ohio replacement for Vandalia.

 

If the EC visited sites and found them problematic without a formal proposal offered, I don't have a problem with that. A formal or a written proposal is a notice of serious intent to provide a product or service. If the ATA put out a notice of request for a host site, the people who made the offers should have put them in writing, then there would be an offer of record which should have required the EC to respond in kind. SOP business practice, especially when you are talking millions of dollars involved. We are not talking about a lemonade stand or swap meet here.

 

Just for information, Sparta was originally turned as a site for the ATA for what reasons I don't know or can't remember and I don't remember the reason it was reinstated at a later date. Memory does things to you as you get older. I hope the people that can remember will post the reasons. Help would be appreciated.

 

The site in Sparta did not and could not qualify until it became a lease deal without the due diligence clause ... This was made known before the site was later accepted by the ATA and then everything changed ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

Folks, where was the prospective Indiana site, and what does a dual trapline look like?

 

Dual trap line? Imagine two rows of trap lines, 50 traps on each line. Either a parallel line of traps facing opposite like one North, one South, you have a road or pathway between the two rows of trap lines, shooters along the two rows have their backs to each other. Or a parallel where two lines both facing the same direction, such as North but with a fall zone between the two lines and a high berm down the center. The berm would prevent lead shot from the South row of traps falling on the shooters on the North row of traps.

 

Thanks, AZCO. The first arrangement would disadvantage anyone not facing North.

In the second arrangement, a high berm might make shadows come early to the northward line, but I don't know if this bothers me too much.

 

I sat in on the meeting at Vandalia when the presentations were made. Sparta made theirs, Shelbyille made theirs and Las Vegas did not show up. I asked the rep from West Virginia at the time, after the vote, if his state really wanted to go to Sparta and he told me "no". He said he thought it was the best place so he voted for it. Shelbyville was the best place to move the Grand and it was ignored. There were several rumors that Ohio had several place the Grand could move to, but Tom Aklin, President at the time, nixed them all.

 

Shelbyville, Indiana was in the running?

I guarantee you that if the ATA had picked Shelbyville, the griping would be 1/50th of what it is with Sparta.

There's a casino and horse track in Shelbyville. It's just down the road from Indy, and it's not too far from Cincy.

 

The Shelbyville site would have been owned by the ATA. While this was a dual trap line both trap lines facing north proposal.

At the time the ATA would have to use all its funds and have a mortgage of some 3 to 5 million for the purchase, infrastructure and development in order the be able to hold the Grand at this site. Acklin liked this site and stated that he had people who would eliminate the mortgage if the ATA were to go to Shelbyville. Acklin was asked if this (people who would eliminate the mortgage) was in writing, when he said it wasn't the BOD voted against Shelbyville as the BOD didn't want a mortgage.

Sparta was brought back into the picture with the offer of no financial output from the ATA, just the traps (ATA owned) and anything else that was ATA owned and could be moved. The ATA EC and BOD apparently jumped at the chance and we moved to Sparta.

Just a short summary of the events as they unfolded at that time.

 

Thanks for this background. I didn't know any of this. Right there is the moment of the ATA's colossal blunder. It would be nicer to have it closer to Indy, but Shelbyville beats Sparta by miles. It was a colossal mistake to choose Sparta over Shelbyville, and everyone who picked Sparta should be sacked, as they would be if this were the private sector.

Where was the Indiana rep to push this through?

Is Shelbyville still available? Do you have the specific location?

 

https://www.shootata.com/portals/0/pdf/minutes/8-03special_meeting.pdf

Wow. It looks like the proposed facility was near Co. Rd. 750N and Indiana 9. If that's the site, the ATA really blundered badly by picking Sparta.

The ATA would have had a very friendly home in Indiana, near so much to do.

Opportunities never look as good coming as they do going.

https://www.shootata.com/portals/0/pdf/minutes/meeting8-16-01.pdf

SHELBYVILLE, INDIANA ATTACHMENT C
The written proposal, Attach
ment C hereto, was provided by Shelby County
Development Corporation and contains comprehensive information regarding this site. The site
is known as "Fuller Farms" and consists of approxim
ately (980) acres. The site is quite level and
is aesthetically pleasing. The land is expensiv
e, but a substantial package has been assembled
from the area, including Indiana State Trap
shooting Association, and approximately
$6,000,000.00 has been pledged to assist with
purchase and development costs. The site is
approximately twenty (20) miles southeast of In
dianapolis, Indiana and eighty-three (83) miles
northwest of Cincinnati, Ohio.
There are three hundred (300) motel rooms in Shelbyville,
Indiana and unlimited hotel and motel facilities of all descriptions and price ranges in
Indianapolis. Amenities and necessary facilities are not an adverse issue at this location.
Additional support can be expected from the City of Indianapolis, which promotes itself as the
"Sports Capital of the United States".
The configuration and size of
the property lends itself to development as a
multi-use facility. However, th
e configuration of the property is such that dual or parallel
shooting lines would be necessar
y. The configuration of the property and a treeline on the
property could separate the dual shooting lines
for safety and distraction of competitors from
shooting line to shooting line. The size of
the property limits future expansion and careful
design may be necessary in order to properly lo
cate multi-use areas, ve
ndor space, parking,
and other necessary use areas.

Here's the address that could have been:

1633 E 750 N, Shelbyville, IN