Shooting before plastic shells

When I started shooting trap in the early 60s when I was 2 years old we shot all paper shells. We shot rems feds Winchester Peters and canucks. How many others shot before plastic shells.

 

No wonder you were better than me. I didn't start until I was 19

 

You started shooting trap when you were 2 years old??? Seriously??? I find that just a little hard to believe

 

I began shooting Skeet & Trap in 1961

Here is the shell I used to harvest my first pheasant at 14 years old in 1963. Paper of course.

I have kept that along with the N.R. Davis SxS that got that bird for 57 years.

I also kept the unspent shell from the second barrel.

Remember the Winchester low base shells with the brass so low on the paper you wondered what held them together ?

Memories ~~~~~

 

Began shooting Trap in '63 and of course I loaded many a Federal paper with an "H" wad, 2-3/8" filler wads and 23 grs. of Red Dot. I also baked many a paper shell in the oven in order to squeeze a few more reloads out of each. Those were the days.

 

I started shooting clay targets off a small spring loaded thrower in 1968. I was young and weighed about 80 pounds.
All shells were paper, period, and all clay targets were black.
I shot a .410 and the first time I shot a 12 bore, it knocked me on my ass. After having posture corrected, I was avble to shoot the 12 but with much less accuracy. I could consistently hit a 95 average with the .410.
Within 2 years I was shooting 12 gauge exclusively. That was a long time ago....

 

Every thing was loaded with 23 grs of Red Dot. The shells I mentioned all loaded the same except the Winchester papers they took a shorter spacer wad. Of course loading shells was a pain. All single stage loaders. First turret loader I had was a Texan , still have it. Baking empties was one way to get more loads out of a shell. There was a waxer ,using melted wax, to rewax the crimp to get more loads. Another tool was called a primer pocket pinger. It was used to tighten the primer hole so the primer wouldn't fall out, again more loads. Btw me being 2 must be true. You read it on the Internet.

 

I too remember shooting my first pheasant in 1964. I had a 12 ga. Ithaca model 37 loaded with factory WW paper 6's.
I don't have the shell that I used but I do still have the gun.

Oh, I also have this



Close your eyes and remember. I'll bet you can still smell the empty case when you picked it up.

 

I remember buying my first box of plastic shotshells in 1965. They were Remington loads and the local sporting goods store had them on sale just before the dove opener for $1.99/box. I scraped together all the money I had and bought four boxes.
Before that, it was ALL paper shells.......

 

The upper right shelf has some two piece boxes. A couple are marked "Thicket Loads"

 

Then it must be true. You put it on the internet.

 

Did the oven trick for several year until Mec came out with a shell rewaxer -- mounted on the reloading bench - you would slide your empty shells on it to rewax the paper before reloading --worked great and added may more reload from your paper shells -just had to be careful not to run into the hot iron when you got done.

 

Flyer,

Funny you mentioned that shell and shot size..Yes indeed, mine are the same WW #6.

Oh that smell was wonderful !

The bird was too.

 

Great post, a bit before my time. Born in 1959. Gunning didn't really start until early '70's for me. Real gunning that is. Still have majority of my stuff from back then. Started with a 20 ga. Wingmaster. Still take it out once and awhile. Wish I had 10 cents for every squirrel I got with it. There was an old farmers wife that you couldn't give her enough squirrels. Her gig was making squirrel pot pie. Enjoyed looking at your box collection. Mine is nice, but yours goes back further.

 

Not too hard to believe. The very first gun I shot was an SKS when I was only 3 and I shot my first full auto when I was only 7. Some of us just start earlier than others I guess.

Anyways, as far as paper shells goes, my shooting buddies always seem to have lots of those in their stock of loose ammo. I personally can't stand them due to how they have swollen over time and are a huge bitch to chamber let alone extract. They always go boom though so that's a plus.

 

Before I got into shooting Federal Papers, I shot the Winchester papers and to this day feel they were a better shell for handicap ... I never re loaded the Winchesters because where the crimp always seemed to be pieces missing, not so on the Federal Papers ... Back then there was 20 boxes in a case, not 10 like there is today ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

Yeah, but the smell of those Feds.

Shamus and I shot every event one year at the Grand in Vandalia.. I used the Feds for caps and the Super Targets for singles and doubles. By the time the doubles came around on Saturday I had to open the 3200 to the side to keep that foul smelling smoke away from my face. Doubles were the worst. You got two doses of smoke from whatever they used for powder.

They DID crush targets and regardless of what the graphmaster said, they WERE soft shooting.

I think I know where there are a couple of "cases" that just might be available if I want them.

 

Those were the ones, great shells ... I won a lot of money shooting those ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

There is a difference between pulling the trigger on a shotgun that Grandpa was holding for you and shooting trap.

 

True story, I never shot a clay target before 1967. Back then we were playing with muzzle loaders & a friend wanted to shoot some "rocks" after work one night. I only had my percussion 16 SxS with and went 10 straight with it. It was to slow to load so I switched to something else (M12 field gun) the next time we shot.

 

Tough on doubles I'll bet

 

The Win. super target were the best in their day, but could not compare to the premium shells we shoot today. Roger C.

 

I always wondered that too -- That's why when we went duck hunting, we went the other way - shooting Imperial High base -Bought at our local Holiday gas station --They where the highest brass based paper shell I can ever remember seeing - I think they where made in Canada?

 

I started shooting in 1952. I was 10 years old. I remember helping my dad cut wads etc. My main job was using the tool my dad made to strip the brass off the hulls when they would't hold a crimp anymore. It was hard times in 1952 although I didn't know it at the time.
We could shoot a 10 bird practice for .40 cents

 

Ollie, Kicked like hell, but we didn't care because we didn't know better !!!

 

And you wonder why I've been shooting release triggers since 1972.

 

Oh, the memories. Acme press, #57 primers, cardboard and fiber wads, 23 gr of Red Dot, the smell of the fired hull. Shot the first Tenn Volunteer Skeet shoot in 1958. Shot the 12 ga in the Volunteer in 2019, hope to shoot one event in the Volunteer this year.

Started loading in 1958. Much better shells, loaders, and everything else.

 

I shot Winchester Super Targets that were paper even though they sold plastic shells. I liked the Federal papers and shot a lot of them too. Them were the days a case of any shells were 20 boxes or 500 shells. The Super Targets smelled really bad but I think they were the best shell made at the time. Soft shot by today's standards but they crushed 3-hole handicap targets as well as any shell.

 

"20 boxes or 500 shells."

Leo Cerar loved us
Our squad used to buy 5 cases each of Fed Papers at the start of the season. 25 cases in one purchase. Since I shot them for both registered and practice those 5 cases got me about half way through the season.

Then you took your winnings and bought more to get you to the beginning of GRAND week in VANDALIA.

 

Flyersarebest, A friend and I would go to Richmond Ind. to a federal plant and buy 100 cases of paper shells in the early spring, and shoot them all summer. 20 box cases. This was in the 70's highest we ever paid was $21.50 a case. THEM WERE THE DAYS. Roger C.
P.S. Brad the friend was Ramo.

 

I shot the win super targets for a few years but I broke my first 100 from 27 with fed papers and my second with the super targets. I think the super targets were better at 27 than the feds but they smelled awful compared to the fed papers.I liked reloading fed papers better than even AA's as I got a lot better crimp with the feds, and truer wad pressure.

Back in the day we didn't fixate on shell speed like everyone seems to do today. So many of the younger hunters who come to my pheasant hunting place think that speed kills and pay little attention to shot size or what the shot is made of. The old paper hulls that we shot with were every bit as good as today's ( I think better ) shells. The Quality control of the major ammo companies has really gone down on Shot shells but is much better on the center fires today than when I was young.

New shooters don't compete like we used to for cash and a dud or two doesn't cost them like it did us. Writers and the ammo manufactures have sold the idea that speed is the most important factor for a shot gun shell over everything else and the younger generations that never have shot a good paper shell have bought into the idea.

On my pheasant hunting preserve I don't allow shot smaller than 5's and no steel shot at all , Copper and Nickle coated lead so much the better. Shot size is much more important than speed or choke in bird hunting, and trap shooting too. I tell the new bees than lead and ability run out long before speed and choke. Most times a pheasant can be killed a lot farther with 4'a or 5's with a skeet choke than a hunter can hit it. Big shot kills better and breaks targets better too. Give me a slow load of 5's or 6's at any pigeon shoot I was ever at and I would have been a happy man, remember no shooting rule say how small of shot you can use, just how big and no Copper or Nickle coated at trap and at a lot of live bird shoots too.

But all being said nothing every smelled better to me than a fed paper at Vandalia on an 90 degree August afternoon.

 

Brad,
I can certainly attest to the open choke and big shot size philosophy. I normally use a cylinder bore and skeet choke in my 20 ga O/U at your preserve with copper or nickel # 4 shot. I have never put the gun on paper to prove this, but I feel the larger shot size does better with a more open choke. With the dogs we are running we don't often take a shot much beyond 30 yards. However there have been a few occasions when we have stretched those open chokes out and dropped birds a good bit beyond that 30 yard mark. If you look at a ballistics chart on shot speed vs shot size you will find that larger lead shot does not loose its velocity as quickly as smaller shot and therefore doesn't need to leave the muzzle at a blistering speed. This past season I used my A400 in 28 ga with a skeet choke and 7/8 oz of 5's. Still carries plenty of power but I do try to limit the shooting distance to inside that 30 yard mark. When it comes to shot, size does matter.