Championship Series - At your club(s) Schedule an event.

If your club is interested in holding one or more of the Championship Series shoots you can PM us on this site.

Your club must have the following
4 traps.
Must be able to throw a 45 degree target 55 yards.

 

pm sent

 

What is the format for these shoots.

 

pm sent

 

And where does one find the format?

 

Angles will be straightaway or wider than straightaway from stations 1 and 5.
1 ounce loads maximum.
Maximum velocity less than 1200 fps
Minimum distance targets 55 yards.
All ammo will be given at the line.
All shoots will be qualifying shoots for national championship shoot. Qualifiers can shoot for all the prizes.
All events will be 125 birds.
First 25 targets will be to get your handicap for the next 100 targets. All shoot from the 25.
Re-squad following first 25 targets.
Minimum handicap yardage 20.
Next 100 targets will be shot from established handicap. 20-25.
No do overs. All birds called for that are legal are shot at or are a loss.
All targets are considered legal if they come out of the house whole.
There is no allowance for mechanical failures, flinches, etc.
A target called loss is scored a loss. A piece not seen by the scorer doesn't count.
Clubs will determine target costs.
Shooters will be permitted a buy in. You can enter an event twice (time permitting)
Special Events are at the discretion of shoot management.

We will be working out some of the details with the shoot managements. There will be more formal ads placed on this forum.

Sponsors/vendors are encouraged to contact us. Please use pm function.

 

Simple, I like it. Eliminates age and sex.
Comments and questions
1. Might loose some shooters who shoot reloads but I understand and support the reason for new shells.
2. How will the available money be divided among the the 6 yardage groups?
3. Consider doing away with "the let's see one or more birds".
4. Consider miss and out for all shoot-offs
5. Consider using the same rules for doubles except for example, shoot 10 pairs from the 23. Re-squad after the first 10 pairs. Minimum doubles yardage 18 and max doubles yardage 23. Next 20 pairs shot from established doubles score on the first 10 pairs. Break all 20 (10 pairs) shoot the next 40 (20 pairs) from the 23, break 19 shoot from the 22, break 18 shoot from the 21, break 17 shoot from the 20, break 16 shoot from the 19 and break 15 or less shoot from the 18.

 

We want to hear more ideas for this program. As we move forward we may make some subtle changes. We appreciate the input.

We will encourage the management of shoots to have a long run purse from both ends.
There are no doubles events.
We like the idea of miss and out for shoot-offs. We will look at that. We will probably leave that up to shoot management.

No yardage groups.

Forgot to mention.....>>>>>

NO MEMBERSHIP DUES

NO DAILY FEES

 

There is no allowance for mechanical failures, flinches, etc.
1.Consider adding bloopers/squids to the above sentence.
2. Consider random trap assignments with shotgun starts.
3. Consider eliminating unfilled squads before assigning a new squad number.
4. Maybe the doubles event as exampled above could be trialed as a special event at a latter dated to see if there is enough interest to add it to the program.

 

Add some 10 bird races during the main event. Do not count towards Championship series. Must sign up for the 125 bird event to be eligible to shot the 10 bird. Shoot from 22 yd, then if ties, the first high score decides where to shoot off from. Example, next to flag pole, under Hackberry tree, under porch etc. Mandatory purse, $30 to 50.
We have a big turn out for these 10 bird events where i shoot.

 

Some Questions?

First 25 targets will be to get your handicap for the next 100 targets. All shoot from the 25. What will happen when all 5 Shooters simply dump 5 to shoot next 100 from 20 instead of 25? Won't this encourage Sandbagging?

A target called loss is scored a loss. A piece not seen by the scorer doesn't count. How will you guarantee top quality scorers that won't be distracted, and how will "obvious" breaks, called incorrectly, then be handled? I ask as some clubs would have Scorers that participate in the event and could be biased?

All ammo will be given at the line. Will every club involved be required to shoot the same type/manufacturer?

 

Smoke 'em. Tighten the choke and quit whining we say. If the scorer doesn't see the chip...it was called correctly. Target claimers won't be happy.

Guessing you have scorers that are biased at your club. This isn't going to be a democracy at the line. We will not be voting as to whether the target is dead. The scorer will yell loss! All you need to know.

 

Yes.....you get your shells at the line. They will be on a bench beside the scorer. All will have the same shells.

 

Interesting!!

One last question? With 4 Traps being the Minimum, you're only expecting @ 200 shooters max per Event, or will multiple days be involved?

 

If someone is currently banned from ATA, and they show up, can he, she, they shoot? No one in particular, mind you.

 

I like it.

 

Gun Clubs will decide who can be on their property.

 

We expect some may decide to do this and play the long run from the back. We don't care. If you think that is where the money is. At what # bird do you think you can run them all?

 

Obviously a NON ATA event which will allow a lot of regular blue collar workers, who at best can only find time to shoot the local leagues, a chance to participate in something big.

I hope this goes over well.

I LIKE it !

 

I am guessing that SPECIAL EVENTS are welcome!

 

[QUOTE="NEOBT, post: 56238, member: 3886"]I am guessing that SPECIAL EVENTS are welcome![/QUOTE]
SPECIAL EVENTS are at the discretion of host clubs.

The money options as follows:

Long run from the start (includes first 25)
Long run from the back (includes first 25)
Jackpot / percentage determined by shoot management

 

The more I think about this the better I think it is.

I can see some clubs finding out how big this will go over, and host perhaps quarterly shoots of this nature.


Good luck !!!

 

I am interested. I don't see a target requirement!

 

Why is the max handicap distance 25 yards? We have all seen/participated in the ongoing discussion about adding handicap distance. Now we are going to move up?

 

So I break the first 25 and then go to the max of the 25 yd line, WTF. I'd rather have a sister in the whore house then to shoot the 25 yd line. Guys like Harlen, Marshel and other Big Dogs will eat you alive if all they do is go to the 25. I don't care what speed or angles the targets are.

 

To be a little more precise, if one breaks all 25 they should go back to the 27 IMO.

 

BS...55+ yards and 45+degrees is a different game. 55 yard target is like shooting from the 32.

1180 one ounce loads. Chubby boys wont break 115 of 125. Good luck with that thought tho. Also no mulligans.
lol That is just my opinion.

 

They may not break 115 but they will break more than everyone else.

 

How do you know that? Those guys are used to fluffy short targets with 11 pound guns and 3 1/4 dram loads. My locals shoot stuff like this all the time. Should be interesting.

Glad to see this happening. Looking forward to the "chubbies" shooting the same loads as the rest of us. BT99 and other top singles may be the gun of choice. May bring out old 870 competition.

 

Fast targets will need fast guns.

 

What "chubbies" do you think would show up for a 1 day shoot?
Seriously?

 

Win101,
Competitive shooters will, all woosies will stay home. Where do you fit in? Roger C.

 

Roger,
I would seriously doubt that any "BigDogs" would work a 1day shoot into their travel schedule unless they were already in the vicinity.

 

Well, I have never been one to think there was enough money in trapshooting to make that aspect of it a viable lifestyle. But, having said that, if there is enough money on the line, you will get plenty of "Chubbie" "Big Dogs."

 

WIN101, Myself and my best friend would drive from CLEVELAND TO SOUTH OF DAYTON ON A WEEK NIGHT. SHOOT A HIGH DOLLAR BUDDY SHOOT, DRIVE BACK TO CLEVELAND AND BE AT WORK THE NEXT MORNING AT 7:00 IN THE MORNING. I'm sure the chubbies will do the same, they are highly competitive.
WIN101 YOU ARE NOT AS COMPETITIVE AS MANY SHOOTERS ARE AND WERE, WE WOULD GO ANYWHERE TO SHOOT FOR THE BUCKS. Roger C.

 

There are some funny posts above. Some of these guys think the ATA game of shooting slow 16 yard narrow targets would easily relate to 55-57 mph targets being launched. And trying to chase them with 1180 fps one ounce loads. And that standing on the 25 will make everything easier than 27 with slow narrow targets.

And the other idea that the ATA All American will take everyone's lunch money.

We saw a demonstration of that didn't we. Fast targets and wide angles? Some guy by name of Gary Bryant (Longshot) spanked an ATA All American by name of BIG DON. Yeah....it was an ass kicking.

It was probably the largest watched shoot-off in this century. Lots of gambling. Mardis Gras like festival. Everyone coming to see the public hanging of Doc Longshot. How did that work out?

Yeah....keep up with the All Americans will take everyone's money.

 

Anybody know what length the spacer rod between the magnet switch's on a Pat trap would be for 45 degree targets? A lot easier to adjust the field if the switches can be moved as a unit.

 

Thanks Dave S
Keeping all the traps at exactly 45 degrees is not the goal. More than 45 is fine. The minimum is 45. Spread them and cranks them.

 

Math class

## These guys will be throwing a target about 14 mph faster at the house.
## That is about 30% faster.
## When the previous targets would have traveled 21 yards these targets will have traveled close to 7 yards further.
That extra 7 yards happens in a blink.

Add 1180 feet per second to the equation.

You should be able to practice this from the 32 yard line with 2 3/4 dram shells. I don't see too many breaking 110.

 

If two good "bunker boys" show up the rest are toast. They break straights with 7/8 oz. loads on much wider faster targets.

 

Would like to add to the above format; The gun club in Shelby, Ohio that shoots the above shoot, also has a shoot off rule that after 5 rounds and there is no single winner, then purse is split...No long shoot offfs..
My opinion if this is adopted the shooter supplies his/her own favorite shells, reloads or new. Then after enough of these extra long distant shoot offs with wide angles one can see who the really long shots are. Might be Gary, might not...but would be FUN to watch. AND SHOOT

 

I'll bite. Tell me why in math terms the bunker shooters do not dominate ATA events.

 

There is always someone in the crowd that will want to make the game easier. All will use the same shells. Cheats will have to stay home.

 

The shell thing was for 10 bird shoots, not Championship shoot,
.

 

I like the "no dynamite" shells. No roll your own. All with the same challenging ammo. The sponsored ATA shooters will have to shoot the same ammo as the rest of us. That will keep a few away. Just the thought of a fair game.

 

Bunker targets are often higher. They are not heading out of town at the moment of launch. Also there is not as much talent in the bunker game.

 

I had the Pleasure of watching some of the Olympic bunker shooters practice up at Ben Avery some time back .... Some of them make those challenging bunker targets look like 2 hole straight away's from 3 if you know where they are going ... Some very nice kids besides being really good and consistent shooters ... I think they came down from Colorado a couple years ago for what ever reason ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

Ya might want to ask Rachel Hopkins that same question!

 

I would say because most of the people shooting bunker don't shoot American trap anymore.
Some because they're chasing a spot on the Olympic team.
Some because they got bored with American trap.
Bunker is more challenging with lighter loads, faster targets, extreme angles and much higher and lower targets.
Targets are 1-3 meters ( 3'3"-9'10") off the ground. Targets travel 76 meters (250'+/-) instead of 50 yards. True 45 degree angles and 68 mph vs. 40+/- for American trap targets.
Have you ever shot bunker Statman?

 

Bunker shooters get 2 shots at a single target.

 

I personally don't worry about 1 ounce loads, but I would like 1300fps shells, 1 oz #6s @1300fps

GB,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,DLS

 

I don't know about "math terms." But I can answer your question.
Cause they don't shoot ATA events. They shoot bunker. That is their game and what they prefer.
But to give you an example of a bunker shooter shooting ATA with almost no practice, a California bunker shooter named Brian Burrows grew up in a traditional ATA family in San Diego. His grandfather was a long time ATA shooter with lots of silver to his credit. Brian was born in 1988 and learned shooting on ATA birds and in about 2004 he was introduced to bunker. He has shot on the US team for quite a few years and has twice won the national championship. He couldn't make a living shooting trap and quit shooting bunker full time or shooting virtually anything else a few years ago. Two years ago, he attended the California State shoot with his grandpa. He shot a couple of events and won the California State Singles Championship with 200 straight and I don't know how many in the shootoff.
Trust me, ATA targets are EASY for good bunker shooters. Real easy.
Dan Carlisle or Ray Stafford ring a bell? Both shot bunker on the US team.
Jake

 

As did Frank Little.

 

Of course will never know, but would have loved to see how Frank would have placed in the new series shooting from the 25 with the 1 oz slower loads. I'd pay good money to watch.

 

I don't remember Frank shooting more than 3 dram 1 1/8 oz. loads in those old Remington green shells from the 27.

 

I know the guy that broke into Frank's garage and stole some of his Remington ammo. He had two pallets of the greenies. They were tested. They were very hot! Well over 1300 fps.

We will see who can stand at the 25 with slow 1 ounce shells. I think a few will be humbled. Some locals used to shooting the fast birds at protector shoots might clean up.

 

Ya mean those slow loads used by the locals in protection shoots loaded with ++++++ grs. of Longshot-no thanks. Now about that last fantasy-another old wives tale. Besides, those familiar with proper use of a chronograph know leading pellets of a shot charge often read much higher than the actual payload.

 

Current ATA rules call for a target to be between 49 and 51 yards from the trap at app. 43 mph. So these targets are scheduled to travel 4 yds. beyond current ATA requirements. I must brush up on my "new math" skills.

 

When are you projecting that these events will take place?
How many locations are you hoping for?

 

Any good Bunker Shooter would cleanup on those P*SSY targets the ATA shoots now.

GB.......................................DLS

 

The mass is what the Chronograph works on, it is blocing the light, one pellet will not do it, sorry to burst your bubble.


GB..................................DLS

 

The shot mass is approx 29"inches long, but leading mass is what triggers the Chrono.

GB.....................................DLS

 

I shot Bunker one time w/a brand new Trap Combo. and shot with the best shooter Cardinal Had, I broke 49/50 used the 2nd shot 3 times, it was an awakening exp. this was a true 15 trap bunker set up, It was the o/u Bbl w/double release triggers and first time I shot the gun, I set the Bbl up as High as it would shoot w/32"in Full, IMP Mod tubes., The gun was a Caesar Guerini.

GB..................................DLS

 

Great shooters will excell in any of the shooting sports.

 

It may be 29" long but not 29" from the sky screens.

 

Well, does anyone recognize the fellow on the left ?


Not a bad shot at the American Trap game.

 

Don Haldeman (sp) from PA













n

 

The relationship between the increase in yardage and speed is not linear. An extra mph does not necessarily get you an extra yard. Most of the ATA events I have been to have targets landing around the 47. A minimum 55-57 yard target will be cranked. At 57 that is 10 yards further. Probably at least 12 mph faster than and ATA target.

I see the 55 yard target is the minimum for this game. yikes!

 

The logic of thumping your chests because a deceased shooter that is or was your idols escapes me. I will give 20-1 odds Frank Little wont enter any of the events.

I am guessing this is marketed to some younger shooters, protector shooters, bunkers shooters (not many out there), and newbies looking for a fun game. I saw in previous posts that only 1 in 10 targets are ATA registered in OH and PA. That group is a small number.

 

Another note: They have more kids showing up for scholastic shoots than show up to shoot what the ATA calls "Grand". They aren't shooting registered targets.

I have to find that 870 Competition in my closet somewhere. Wish I had a model 12. Just thinking.

 

The "Championship Series " is by design formatted in such a way to give many shooters what they have wanted and asked for, for a number of years ... It obviously by design eliminates any shell advantages (ammunition) or what has become the norm for the past 20 years plus with target settings ... I'm not to sure it will eliminate registered targets but will give shooters something else to look forward to on occasion, kind of on the order of regulated games but with limitations set forth for everyone who competes ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

New Game
ATA take notice. If this new game takes as many registered shooter from the registered ranks as Sporting Clays did you are standing in deep DOO-DOO.
If you do not do something to fix the mess you have made out of registered targets, you may loose the rest of your shooters. Sporting Clays has already shown that the new generation of shooters want targets that are more of a challenge than what you have to offer as of now. The hand writing is on the wall, are you smart enough to read what it is telling you?
If the EC is not going to make the changes that shooters want, then the EC should resign in mass, and let the members choose new leaders for our sport. And do away with the progression for being the Pres. No closed door meetings, publish all content of the meetings within 14 days of when they happen. RECORD all votes with name of delegate and his state.
This is an idea of a good start for saving the sport. This are my ideas, Can anyone else add to these suggestions?
Roger C.

 

Brads friend, Do you recognise the gent in the red suit? Roger C.

 

Please tell all of us how you know the targets were landing at the 47 yd. mark-especially since most fields rely on a radar gun to determine distances and stakes were removed. By the way, your so-called 47 yd. targets are illegal by a minimum of two yards.

 

Statman, If you're referring to SCTP when you say "Scholastic" they are most definitely shooting ATA registered targets at all State, Regional and National competitions. In my experience, most smaller invitational SCTP competitions are also registered targets. My team will start registering at least one weekly practice per month next year. We compete in AIM/ATA handicap also so registering targets only makes sense.

 

Kilman: I read somewhere that AIM & SCTP would not be shooting Registered Handicap Targets, only 16yds


GB.............................DLS

 

No sir.
Scholastic is a term referring to having a link to a school.
This system does not need target registration. (as far as I read)

But as to the statement "most definitely shooting registered targets" you would be wrong. SCTP does not register handicap targets for the SCTP.

 

Brads friend,
He looks a lot like Paul Shaw from Canada. Roger C.

 

AIM targets are all registered with the ATA. That includes singles, handicap and doubles.

 

Of course it's Paul.

 

Again, very irrelevant. AIM represents a miniscule amount of scholastic shooting. Minnesota High School Clay Target League and Minnesota High School Clay Target Leagues are examples of scholastic organizations.

Why would anyone in high school register targets if you have that type shooting as an option? And this type event (championship series) where any high schooler can enter without having to register targets. I would say the ATA is on the outside looking in.

 

STaT mAn STaN, you wrote above

1, "Math class

## These guys will be throwing a target about 14 mph faster at the house.
## That is about 30% faster.
## When the previous targets would have traveled 21 yards these targets will have traveled close to 7 yards further.
That extra 7 yards happens in a blink."

That looks way too fast to me. Where did you get those numbers?

2. "The relationship between the increase in yardage and speed is not linear."

How do you know this? Do you have any evidence for that claim?

N1H1

 

Lots of new math present with these numbers plucked from the sky.

 

Oops, I see that it was Jim/Canton who wrote "The relationship between the increase in yardage and speed is not linear."

How do you know this, Jim? Do you have any evidence for that claim?

You are predicting just a 12 MPN increase on needed speed, not SMS with 14 MPH. Though 2 MPH slower, that still seems like a lot to me. How did you obtain that number?

N1H1

 

SCTP doesn't register targets at all. All singles targets thrown at sanctioned SCTP events most assuredly are registered with the ATA. Currently, SCTP only recognizes handicap targets shot from the 25 yd line. That's subject to change, and will eventually. But, any sanctioned SCTP competition targets are most definitely registered with the ATA.

 

LIke a bad penny he just keeps showing up

 

A younger Paul Shaw.

He can still shoot pretty darned good in both venues.

 

Hi N1H1
Great to see you on the thread! I am sure it rubs you the wrong way. Just the talk of a challenging shotgun sporting event is contrary to that lifetime award you received. I can see where this thread must really chap your britches

Tell me if I got this right. Minnesota said you were "instrumental in getting the 3 hole setting rescinded."

Are you proud of that lifetime award? Imagine all you accomplished. And you took a gun that was against the by-laws? Did you? Did you know much about the ATA bylaws?

Which are you most proud of? Getting the gun that was against the by-laws? Or was it taking the sport out of trapshooting?

(I guess N1 may have me blocked so he doesn't have to answer. Members should feel free to repost this.)

 

SCTP Handicap targets are not registered with the ATA. Not that it matters. My kids have no interest in ATA. This game may interest them.

 

Will N1H1 return that gun? Now that's funny?
---------------------

No info on the prizes yet. How about a BIG GUN?

 

You have a better chance of winning the lotto than you do of EVER seeing him give that gun back. You want to know why?

HE THINKS HE DESERVED IT.

Dysinger was right.

 

And to all you ring kissing lurkers, like the one that has to hunt for his IQ of 44 or any of his ata loving pals, I probably won't make any of these shoots but I do hope they happen. And kids, why I won't be able is none of your business.

Just the thought of all of you blowing a gasket is worth it. I do think you could be a bit more vile in your description of this site and the people on it. The usual crap you all post is getting old. The name calling and changing and the " I'll NEVER shoot in Ohio" is pretty lame. As if anyone in Ohio would even know who you were.

You can do better than that can't you?
How about saying something about our families? Maybe some of us have a handicapped child you can take a swipe at. Or maybe some of the posters here are very ill. Now that would be a perfect time to belittle them wouldn't it?

You see boys, and I do mean BOYS, the joke is on you. You have been HAD. You can try to build up the ata and that mini grand you all get excited about but deep down, when you are sitting there reading about the glory days of Trapshooting that we all lived, you know that the ata screwed the pooch and now that is what you are stuck with. I could say I feel sorry for you but to be truthful I'm really not. Like I've said in the past, I hope they keep their "grand" in that place in IL. forever, no matter what they have to charge all of you.

Of course most of you don't really shoot that much or in that many places like we all did so it isn't really any great loss to the "almighty" ata if you show up or not. As long as you keep paying their dues they couldn't care any less.

Now THAT is funny.

Hey neil, make sure you run back and tell your minions about this post too.

Dysinger was right.

 

I know I am right, I read that the SCTP & AIM were only allowed to register 16 yard targets, One of the coaches also told me this. you gotta show me the ATA records on this to prove me wrong.

GB.................................DLS

 

PatTraps Phone # 603-428-3396, ask for a trap mechanic he can tell you

GB...................................DLS

 

6-7/8" cyl travel set by REED SWITCHES for a 3 hole 45 Degree angle setting 6-7/8" inches between angle reed switches
I got info from Pat Traps a 4-1/4 bar for 2 hole targets between reed switches.

GB.............................DLS

 

Five and a quarter inches between the reed switches for a three-hole.

Page 23 of the manual for the newer machines.

N1H1

Note: The manual describes three-hole as forty degrees.

 

We do not care what setting is 40 degrees. These targets will be 45 degrees.

 

And to be even clearer, 45 degrees is the minimum. This program is not out to set exact, and precisely set targets at exactly 45 degrees. This program is designed to be challenging. And repeating there is no registration of targets required.

 

Glad to see that the targets going further and more challenging angles, ie, a fantastic new direction.
Maybe you guys should get a Lifetime Achievement Award, if you pull this off.