Preregistration and Bank selection redo for Pros at the grand

Word is the bank selection system failed to get the pros the banks they wanted. Oooops. Guess what? The ATA is reported to be giving a mulligan to themselves and those with enough power to get preferred sqads and traps.

My question.....with 160 traps why do you need preferred pre-squadding? It is not like the place is Vandalia. There isn't 5,000 shooters. All the banks are the same right?

If all that is right then the only answer I have is cheating. Yep I said it. Why else would you demand to have a chance to choose who will be standing beside you saying he got piece of that one. Or the right scorer?

Ronnie

 

Better count the traps again. 160? Ever really been there?

 

There has always been a certain group of people (ED, EC, some of the BOD, Big dogs, Pro's ) who luck out and always seem to get the preferred traps, this has been a common practice for years ... I witnessed two squads of Top Guns pay to get on traps other than the ones they got in the draw ... One particular day the wind kicked up and they got the traps they wanted with a 35 MPH wind right in their face, naturally they complained about that also ... People pull multiple squads so once the squads are drawn they just take the one or ones they want and discard the others ... There are somethings that are never going to change so get used to it or get to be a Big Dog so you can play that game ... There are a few who don't care where or who they shoot with, but not very many ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

I never found a bank draw advantage at Vandalia. East end, west end or in the middle was all the same to me for shooting. Bank selection seemed to me to be more related to convenience of location. Vendors wanted to shoot near their shops. Campers wanted to shoot near their camping spot.

Sparta is different. I have been there. Everybody drives to near their trap assignments. So by process of elimination; there must be some other advantage not present in Vandalia in getting a certain bank area. Is it a surprise that the elite officials want the same banks requested by the elite shooters?

 

And some wonder why ATA shooting and the so called "grand" is heading downward. A few bums in charge are gaming the system with preferential squadding for their buddies and the "big dogs". Gee, 100 squads put in the bank for a few workers many of whom don't even shoot. I always enjoy the crap and bull stories coming out of EC members mouths justifying this little glitch. Let the peasants eat cake sayeth the powers at the top. And to think this bs artist will ultimately be the official voice of the ATA when the winner of musical chairs finally makes it to president. The era of legitimate competition is over.

 

There are 121 traps at Sparta if you look at Google earth and count them.

 

Even some of the most loyal subjects of the "ATA" are starting to say ..... "I am NOT going to the "grand", because I am tired of being treated poorly by those with elitist attitudes running the ATA" .....

No one can blame them for getting 'fed-up' with the "ATA" ..... It just seems hard to see how they now differ from the "bashers", that most have many years of 'prior' experience to get 'fed-up' with the actions of the now elitist "ATA" .....

 

It is the elites complaining the mega elites got an unfair advantage trying to get an unfair advantage.

 

I am not sure where anyone comes up with 100 squads that are reserved. If you look at event 24 Grand American, there are 28 squads that are not selectable and they are almost entirely traps 12 through 16 which are across from the campers. On the first event, there are 19 non-selectable ones (about 100 posts not squads). If you look you will see the "big dogs" squadded but they did that squadding after it opened up. What you don't see is the officials of the ATA that the squads are reserved for. And no people do not reserve more than one squad unless they are using other peoples names and numbers and there is no drawing of traps at the Grand.

 

100 squads reserved for ATA officials? And you know this but no one can see their names? Using other people's names is another trick?

Looking another way....ATA officials have squads they could give away? 100? LOL Corruption at it's finest.

And now I am reminded of the free campsites given to the ATA. TOO FUNNY. YOU GUYS ARE FOOLS!

 

Why would officials need the best banks at Sparta? They are only called for shootoffs to work them.

 

The ATA BOD, EC, and staff have such low averages, and just OCCUPY the 27 Yard Line, How many times have you seen them Place, Let alone win from Prime Banks.

GB...............................DLS

 

You don't have to shoot there. What is the big fuss? Did something new happen?

 

RHIP as they used to say in rank based organizations. The problem is the privilege makes no sense at all in this case.

 

You are right. I do not have to shoot there. I am neither pre-squading or attending.

The big fuss is many of those going and not going find the arrangement to fail the smell test and taste test.

It did probably go on back in Ohio. It was a proximity thing based on the location of the meeting room. I did shoot the GAH with one ATA President one year. He was not an elitist in my view. Everyone on his squad got there by pot luck signing up on the grounds. It was a good time of day to shoot from the 27 with good light. The particular President was no slouch as a competitor. He won honorary yards that year as did other former Presidents.

As stated previously, banks did not matter at Vandalia. If you shoot Sparta you should know they do or are in denial. Maybe denial promted your questions. You may tell us......or not.

 

You are right. The business of whatever those guys do will continue. I am not in denial. I am in not caring. Too much importance placed on a few venues in the hands of even fewer.

 

I did notice that quite a few squads of name shooters were already pre-squadded for every event when the site opened. That is a problem for me. Let's just call it "presquadding for the pre-squadding".

 

I have heard your background. Did you ever have that opportunity? tia

 

120 - 130- 160 - 200 ? Do you have to go there to see empty traps? I would rather use the satellite.

 

Late 80's thru early 90's I was connected and we would pull our PA squads before the squading opened. FWIW, only one squad was pulled before the window opened for everyone. I did hear that the main squad girl would pull and save squads for her friends. Another FWIW, I've been preaching for scrambled banks in PA for 40 years.

 

Butch I can remember standing in line at Vandalia and me, Leo, whomever we were shooting with would get there about 4 or 5 am the day squading opened. We'd take chairs and play cards until the office opened at noon. Every year that I was first in line at the window a lot of squad tickets were already gone. It's just easier for the average shooter to get it in the rear today without knowing about it than back when we were traveling.

I'm like you, the shoot should be on scrambled banks, or better yet walk the like we did in the old days and everyone would shoot the whole line. Most fair system. Brad

 

We were 30 years younger when walking the entire line was in favor. The average trapshooter today is in his 60's or older so walking 48 traps without oxygen stands might reduce ATA's numbers even more. But it was great fun riding those buggies to far away banks wasn't it?

 

Hey Brad, we'll never bring back the good old days. I think I remember someone paying Jean Greb to stand in line and pull squads. Gene Anastasio saw that and thus pre-squading was born. Pre-presquad the past presidents would get their pick of squads, at least the one I shot with did. After presquading started I would put in for squads and get everything I asked for at the times requested. I was shooting with the same guys those years one of which was a past president. Butch

 

ollie, everyone I see at the Cardinal is driving a golf cart today, they don't even walk one field. There is no reason not to scrap the bank system. If some shooter is really that bad off they maybe shouldn't be shooting anyhow at a LARGE tournament. Brad

 

Golf carts aren't allowed in PA and the buggies are grounded. I'll vote for scrambled banks just like at the Silver Dollar.

 

You can use carts at Elysburg.

 

But not on the trapline.

 

Elysburg can adjust the rules. They are quick to do that. They have been proactive creating new rules for removing shells. Allowing carts should be easy.

 

Allowing carts but refusing to scramble banks just gives more obese, aging prima donnas another advantage.

 

How? Explain.

 

The upper banks are golf cart accessible and preferred by the prima donnas. The lower banks are less accessible to golf carts along with 5 and 6 and the average nobody will likely be squadded on those banks. There is also a traffic hazard between banks 6 and 7 encouraging contact between cars and carts. Not a bright idea.

 

Oleo, You are so right.
And, I am just another of that dying group.
Makes me real sad for the future of trapshooting.

 

PA can handle the walking. Quit whining dawg. The traffic below can be moderated. The old haywagon's worked well before also. Or we can let PA be the only shoot the caters to cheaters. Let the shooters decide.

 

The old hay wagons worked well without banks 7 and 8. You'd need traffic police or stoplights on that road today. Scramble the banks! Regular shooters have little or no input in the operation of the PSSA. That's why nothing will ever change.

 

They have police at the CC. They have Homeland Sercurity, State Highway Patrol, Sheriff and SWAT at Illinois. Cause we have shotguns.

 

Are there really new hull removal rules in Elysburg? Do they apply to all hulls or only those in need of removal assistance? Just being curious.

 

All it takes to start bank selections is move a Sliding window over the starting bank, and look down the squad # you are on to see what bank you are shooting
we used this in the 70s at the Ohio State shoot. So simple to use, only difference is the starting Trap is your Starting Bank.
You have 12 Rows of numbers for the Banks,

I was using the CC as it has 12 banks,

I forget how many Banks Missouri has, or total traps they have, but it is very long trap line.

GB............................DLS