Curious About the Grand

I was hoping I could get some kind of an update about the Grand and what we do and do not know as of May 15th. To be honest, even if there wasn't any trouble ahead I wouldn't be going, just can't get the time. I've tried reading all the posts and replies but I tend to forget to check the date posted so the "timeline" gets confusing. I do see that the gov. has vetoed any money in the short term for Sparta but was wondering things like, have vendors been signing up yet? Has the routine maintenance started yet? Facts are great and I also would appreciate opinions (will it happen, where will it happen, how will it happen, etc.) Consider this post just an attempt to collect some ideas all in one place.

Thanks,

Greg

 

That all depends on who you talk to, some claim its sold out others say it not close ... The vendors have not posted much one way or the other so its anybody's guess, being as they are a big attraction at most shoots ... Hope they pull it off and have a good turn out but with the lacking of advertising it that seems to be not very tentative, possible, or probable, but you never know, you know ..? There are a lot of people who have attended for many consecutive years who are not going back because of all of the uncertainty ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

Uncle
Grand Program is post on the ATA Web site

 

Its (the grand program) has been on the ATA web site since 3 months after the last one was in the books, that does not mean anything any more ... Being on the web site for the WSRC has even less meaning being as they close it at will and to hell with the schedule (ask the SCPT) about it ... THINK "Tentative, possible, probable, maybe, MOU " ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

There appears to be some degree of elation being as the advertised prices for targets etc at the grand are the same as last years, but there is no talk about how, who, or what is going to finance the grand being as the State cannot afford to take another financial loss and add to the State deficit ... The facility has added to the States financial woes to the tune of $23 million plus over the past 11 years which would indicate it will be financed by other sources ... The transparency of the ATA is about on par with the Obama administration when it comes to letting the members know what is going on as well as give assurances that the ATA will not finance all cost with the members moneys that have been collected over the years ... Interesting, but the Cardinal Center continues expansion plans right on schedule ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

shootata.com has the program posted for the world to see and enjoy ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

Does anyone, other than me, feel like the taxpayers of Illinois will be the MOST upset if they have to fund the 2016 Grand ????

The Kool Aid Crew thinks the "5 or 6" that "bash" the "ATA" will be the most upset .... but here is a CLUE for their little minds to ponder .... the 2016 Grand will cost me ZERO by choice, the taxpayers of Illinois will not be given that choice if the Grand "happens" .... so on the upset-scale, they should be MUCH higher.

Save the "economic impact" garbage for the newspaper .... I have spent too many years "at the shoots". Trapshooters putting hair in their food so they do not have pay is an everyday thing "on the road".

 

Every other year or so a Chicago news crew films an empty WSRC with its lone resident staying in a camper sayin how nice it is, then tallies up the bill, all as part of a waste in government series. But they kinda backed off when Chicago wanted the summer Olympics which, naturally, includes shooting. Look for another episode soon. But the WSRC ain't what broke Illinois.

 

Tom is right. WSRC did not break Illinois - It broke the back of the sport.

 

The WSRC broke the back of the sport?
How? I don't quite see how. Please explain.

 

Jersey Giant,

I've been thinking about your statement for the last 30 minutes or so.

Do you really believe the "Gun Hating State" of Illinois, in it's infinite wisdom, foresaw the demise of the Vandalia grounds?
They spent millions of dollars to acquire the land and build the WSRC, lure the ATA into moving there, lead them along for 10 or 11 years, then shut the place down under the pretense of a "budget crisis", just to break the sport?

Sounds like something PumpgunBoob would say!

 

Just think if that "Chicago news crew" would have a "story" that would read like this ....

The Illinois based "ATA" has moved it's premier shoot this year, the "2016 Grand", as an effort to possibly help with Illinois budget problems. This Event would require the IDNR to open the WSRC for them. And until the Illinois State budget is resolved, efforts like these will help the State. Many thanks to the Organizations like this that are based in our State.

But .... this is what the "Chicago news crew" will probably feed the current anti-gun culture .... The Illinois IDNR opened the WSRC so the "ATA" could hold their 2016 Grand American Trapshoot. The WSRC has cost the taxpayers ???? millions for the past ???? years .... blah, blah, blah.

The mental-midgets doing all the butt-slaps have no clue how the "other" 350 plus million people view a bunch self-serving "gun-nuts", that cost them tax dollars.

The "news story" about the actions of the "ATA" leaders wearing rose-colored glasses, using tunnel-vision for personal gain, may not read well to the taxpayers of a "gun-hate State".

Carry on in your "fantastic direction" .... I am sure it will be "in the news" ....

 

My statement was not about Vandalia. It was about the sport. Please re-read.

I don't think IL knew the move to the state was going to ruin trapshooting. The members did. The members told the EC and the BOD. They did it in a survey that was ignored. It is posted somewhere on the site.

 

The Program for the grand in posted on the ATA (shootata.com) web site, it reflects no increase in prices from 2015 but anyone with 15 cents worth of brains and common sense has to realize somebody is and has to pay for it some how ... The State has made several comments that they will not and cannot be liable and responsible while operating at a loss , which indicates they are going to be out of it from that stand point which would be understandable ... The Sponsors, Co Sponsors, etc have donated but according to one of the VP's the donations by the Signature Sponsor would not cover the cost of his new pick up truck which would lead one to believe there will be a short fall that has to be covered some how by someone ... If you take into consideration last years attendance for the 2 weeks in come to a little over 30,000 entry's @ $3.00 per would come to between $90,000/ $100,000 which would not put a dent in what it cost the State to operate the facility taking total cost to them into consideration ... Pay roll, electric, water, sewer, and maintaining the place would far exceed those stated amounts ... Some Body is going to pay, the members won't know if its them until its all over obviously, but none the less its not going to be cheap no matter who pays for it to happen ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

"a little over 30,000 entry's @ $3.00 per would come to between $90,000/ $100,000" .....

They would receive ???? amount of money for "camping" and "Vendors" also. How that works for amounts of who gets what is under super-secret lock and key. The "ATA" may pay a "fee" for the entire camp site, the rent/lease them out. The Vending leasing is a guess your best also.

The Kool Aid Crew does not seem to have members that CAN separate "shit from Ice Cream", or they would be more interested in an open operation. They seem to prefer people are forced to accept "shit" and be told it is "Ice Cream".

 

Jersey Giant,

I was not trying to be an a$$ hole, I apologize if it came off that way.
I actually read your post a dozen times before I responded.
I was reading it as you were thinking the WSRC itself was built with the intention of being the downfall to trapshooting.
It may have contributed a bit, but in no way was it intentional.

I never got thee chance to attend Vandalia. From what I have read and heard, it was quite a spectacle.

A question I have always had though is, Had it stayed in Vandalia and the attendance had grown as much as it has supposedly not grown (20-30% or more) would Vandalia have been able to handle up to 30% more shooters? Given the fact it was already basically at it's capacity in it's hey-day?

I'm interested in the comments or thoughts.

 

At 5,000 shooters in a single event it was at its limit. You will never have to worry about that at Sparta. Mission accomplished.

 

The members told the EC and BOD what they would do if it went to Sparta.

I like what User-1 said...

It is really a non issue now. I will be spending my time at the CC. The OP is not about Vandalia. The OP asked if IL is going to spend the money on the repairs that were vetoed. Great question.

 

You are PumpgunBoob. Guessing

 

The ATA was not going to not let (make ) the grand happen at any cost unless it was out of their control and forbidden and hindered (blocked) in some way by the State of Illinois ... Depending on who you talk to, they either have a full house or barely enough committed to attending to bother ... Sooner or later the numbers will come out and be made public, by then it will be to late one way or the other ... Its really at a point where "who cares" one way or the other is the best attitude to have and see what happens ... There are rumors floating around about the Health Dept. getting involved with the mold problem so obviously there are other problems that need to be attended to ( or not) and addressed in a short period of time ... WPT ... (YAC) ...

 

First off, thanks to everyone for responding so far. It does seem like there is a lot of "confusion" about what is going on in the great state of Illinois and how that is going to effect the Grand. I did read this article yesterday concerning Chicago's economy, (trust me, it ain't good), and am assuming (dangerous I know) that the rest of the state is in the same position...

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-...-liabilities-jump-168-understated-115-billion

Illinois is broke, worse than broke, and it would be foolish of them to commit ANY kind of resources to anything other than just what they need to "keep the lights on". It does seem to me like it will either fall 100% on the ATA to put the shoot on IF they can get around the liability problems when it comes to operating on state owned property.

Considering the importance of the Grand to all of us you'd think there would be a LOT more information coming out from HQ. Maybe they're as much in the dark as I am, not sure, but the lack of even comments from ATA is disturbing to me.

Again, thanks to everyone for their input.

 

I think at this point it's how to stop the Bleeding , or at least slow it, if possible.
Few things can operate in the Red, especially for 10yrs.
It will be interesting to see how all this plays out, but don't expect to much info.


Regards....Gerald