IS IT TIME FOR THE GLTA ?

Fill in the blank!!


Gary Bryant....................Dr.longshot

 

Start it up and find out.

 

Doc. I doubt if you will be able to advertise in Trap & Field. You may have to start a magazine also. You will need a computer program to register scores. One that the clubs can log on to for reporting on their shoots. Roger C.

 

Roger that is holding me back, the start up costs, cards,card reader, card electronic data storage. I re-searched it. A manual system would work, as it did in early ATA years

GB..............DLS

 

A manual card embosser is really cheap to purchase.... Here is an example http://www.ebay.com/itm/70-Characte...545253?hash=item259c81d8a5:g:SwMAAOSw7ThUnSM0 If a new organization is viable, a manual system would definitely be the way to start. Cheap to get up and running, and easy to operate. The cost of a start up is minimal. The help is what is the most valuable right now. I am absolutely positive that there are enough shooters out there that would be interested in this that they would be more than willing to donate some financial aid to get it going. If, and I say IF, someone like the Martins wanted to step up and help finance this project, there are a lot of qualified ex-ATA patriots that are readily available to give their input as to what is needed. It will take time, money, and persistence to make it work, but, at this point in time, what have we got to lose? Taking baby steps to get it off the ground would work, and as it grew and more members joined, the steady flow of income would increase to pay for the necessary equipment.... Between the two major trap shooting organizations there is enough information already in place that could be readily applied to the new organization....

 

TRAP 2: Thanks for the info

GB..................DLS

 

You're welcome Gary.... Here is another one that would work very well and cut the embossing time in half, or more....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DATACARD-27...755468?hash=item25b3b4b90c:g:TEMAAOSwNphWWjSt

 

That machine would really cut the Embossing time greatly and Automated, Thanks a bunch

GB.....................DLS

 

I'm always interested in playing news games. What can I do to help? Sounds like a great deal.

 

I do think we need to find a better name for the new Trapshooting Assoc, that would take in all foreign countries and Canadian Provinces. Possible name "International Trapshooting Association" Abbreviated it would be "ITA"
Annual dues $20.00 per year, Lifetime Membership for members under 35 years of age $500, those over 35 yrs $250 and under 65 Yrs ,those over 65 yrs of age would be $100.00. Daily Fees ITA $1.50 + $1.50 State fees. There will be only 2 Sattelite Grands, One WEST of the Mississippi, River and One EAST of the Mississippi, River.

Only Life Members May hold "ITA" Offices. Their will be 2 delegates from each State, Province, Country.

"ITA" President to hold office 4 years, And may be re-elected by the membership for a job well done.
All "ITA" Officers must sign a CERTIFICATE OF CREDIBILITY/HONESTY/FOR THE GOOD OF THE "ITA".
All actions by all "ITA" Officers to be judged by the Membership Accountability Board.

ALL "ITA" Actions will be subject to the ACCOUNTABILITY BOARD.

The "ITA" Grand would Rotate WEST and EAST of the MISSISSIPPI RIVER on Alternant Years. The Gun Clubs that would like to hold the "ITA" Grand would have to have a Minimum of 20 Banks of traps + 2 ADD"L Practice Traps.

Practice Traps to open at 8:00am daily w/practice fees of $6.00 per 25 targets, Doubles Practice to be 5 posts 2 pair per post at a cost of $5.00.

ALL "ITA" Traps must be able to throw 60 yard targets, a 60 degree angle, 30 degrees each side of Center. Have an Interuptor that operates on un-determined intervals. Target Angles to be Minimum of 50 degrees with a distance of 55 yards, for singles/Hdcp. Doubles to be Minimum of 50 yards, with angles a straight-a-way from posts 1 and 5 respectively
Singles /Hdcp to be set 2 yards beyond post #1 and Post #5 respectively.

All clubs must have 27 yard walk-ways.

Any club failing to set targets to specs, will be fined $500 first offense, 2nd offense will lose ability to register targets with the "ITA" for a period of one year.

All "ITA" Traps to be equipped with Voice Calls, approved by the "ITA" Officials to rigid Stds.

Gary Bryant........................Dr.longshot

 

Mandatory purses and how about Calcutta's ?

 

I would suggest working on the small clubs,the ones that are having trouble getting shooters.Let them shoot 50 bird events,less time and money for the shooters (or more money for options).They can always add multiple events or go to 100 birds to fit the shooters needs.The ATA is not going to accept cross registration anyway and no one is going to shoot 1000+ targets in a week at a large club that won't be accepted by the ATA

 

You do know your going against the grain of thought on this site by having an equal amount of delegates from each state. Which by the way is the only FAIR way to go. Thanks Doc.

 

We could care less about the ATA in the new organization, The ATA is a done deal as far as we are concerned. They buried them selves in their actions.

GB...............DLS

 

Gary.... Sure, it's feasible. There are a couple of things that stand out to me: What purpose would 2 satellite grands serve? I don't think there is a need for them. Rotating the "Grand" East to West on alternating years is the only way to go. That way, ALL shooters would have access to the Grand when it's in their area. Let's take the shoots to the shooters, not make them come to us. Would also possibly generate more vendors participation from the West Coast as attending the grand in Sparta is just too far to travel for what little return they get. The other thing that would be difficult, at best, to control would be the targets settings. If it is to be effective, there MUST be someone appointed from the new organization to inspect the target settings at each registered shoot. I agree that if a club decided to throw less than 3 hole targets they should be penalized. I don't believe the club should be fined the first time, I think that any registered scores shot at that club would be considered void immediately. The organization must not allow even one infraction of any rule, for any reason. The only way to build credibility and trust with the new membership is to follow the rules every time, do what it says it's going to do, and to show no favoritism to any club or shooter. Any new organization is going to have some kinks to work out, to be sure, but the main goal of the organization must be fairness, equality, honesty, integrity, and above all else, trust. .... If a club is found to throw illegal targets, all scores must be voided and not allowed, simple as that... If this is done once or twice, sooner or later all clubs would take notice and fall in line...

 

I nominate Brad as the 1st President.

 

Dan Thome: I like your reply, especially on the Satellite Grands. I think having no home Grounds expenses is a Plus, and I like the rules being followed or voided, the Honesty, Integrity and Trust is what is needed.

GB............DLS

 

Dr.Longshot, are you interested in the growth of clay target shooting? The future?

 

Absolutely, w/Honesty, Integrity, at the UTMOST

GB......................DLS

 

The lack of response lets me know your only interested in your own good.

In my opinion, if you want to start any shooting association I wouldn't go about bashing other associations. Your going to start your GLTA off on the wrong foot by doing so. I wouldn't want to go shoot, participate, or even be around someone who will in a moments notice bash on one of the best shooting organizations out there. I'm a life member of the ATA, and have been treated with noting but kindness and respect from the basic shooter, to a delegate, to even the presidents past or present. In this post and previous postings it seems like Dr. Longshot is trying to pick every small thing out about the ATA and the "mistakes" it is making in order to sell his new shooting "group" to the membership of the ATA. But opinions are like assholes, everyone has one. The trick is not being one.

 

You have the Correct Screen Name, and cannot post your real name, The ATA brought itself to the Brink it is almost falling over, through Mis-trust, and so much as 2012PLL, and even the former ATA President Rob Taylor founded, it and you have no Stand On those ATA Problems Mr.PHDWalksincircles, Living in a glass house/cast no stones.
And you misquote the possible new Org as GLTA, and not ITA. Did you read the proposed basic rules of the ITA? You are from the DARK SIDE do not bash the good guys on this site.

Gary Bryant.......................Dr.longshot

 

You got my response, even though you ignored it, HONESTY, INTEGRITY

Gary Bryant...................Dr.longshot

 

Whoa Gary..... I think you may have just crossed the line with walksincircles. You know how I feel about the ATA and what is happening, and agree with a lot of what you have to say, but to attack him and accuse him of lack of integrity and honesty is just plain wrong. You don't know that to be a fact and I don't see it here. I can see nothing in his posts that have either of those. He is simply saying his opinion, and he is entitled to that. I also happen to agree with him. If a new organization is to be effective and succeed, it has to work in HARMONY with both the ATA and the PITA. That doesn't mean the new organization has to emulate them, however, they must be able to co-exist peacefully with them... The goal should be to offer an alternative organization, not the ONLY one...

 

The goal should be to grow the sport. Not take down an association. The sport itself is already degrading, not many new people are participating. And with attitudes that I've recently seen its no wonder it's a downward spiral. This entire sport is supposed to be about having fun, meeting new people, and to have a slight bit of competition. Not about starting a new association because you don't agree with the way things are being handled. Why don't you step up and try to make the positive changes for the ATA, instead of being so demeaning towards it. Clearly you have all the right ideas, and know what changes need to be made. Go and handle them, and stop talking about them. And as far as integrity goes, we all know you have so much. Again, the trick is not being one.

 

How many traps per bank? 20 banks equals 80 traps or 40 traps?

 

How would you address shooters that want to shoot ITA targets but their state doesn't belong to it?

 

Why do you even need state associations? If it takes hold you'll already have someone in the area doing the work to get things started. Let the people willing to work on the initial efforts be the ones in charge of overseeing the new shoots. You can always add layers of management as you grow the association. You may even find you don't need a lot of management just a small group to record scores and provide current info to those interested. If you have a good product you'll find shooters to help expand in their area. Just a thought. You'll be offering harder targets and lower scores so some may not want to cross register at first and maybe never but I think you'll find some competitive shooters that actually want a challenge. I wonder if a shooter personally gets more self satisfaction out of a hard 97 or an easy 100?

 

How about the bookkeeping and banking?

Every club doesn't have members with time and knowledge to take care
Of these important issues.

Just my opinion, but why not try to seriously improve what we already
Have.

Would you want a magazine? Everyone likes to read about their own
And friends successes. I know how hard the execs of trap and field
Work. I mean work constantly.
And then do you really think that competent people won't get too
Exhausted to shoot?
This idea of a new organization may be great' but it does seem a shame
To throw out the ATA just because of a few greedy and self important
Individuals.
We sat back and let the problems accumulate, how do you know it
Won't happen again in a fresh environment?
A small group cannot do a job of this magnitude. Most of the people
Unfortunately, do not stay young.the young are busy working in order
To raise and educate their families. Time is valuable, most do
Not have unlimited time.
Again just my opinion, but please
Try to revive the ATA.

Greta c

 

Greta... I agree 100%. The foundation and infrastructure is already laid with the ATA and, in a perfect world, would be the obvious place to start. The problem, however, is the people running it. At this time, it would take an act of God to get that house cleaned up as they all cover each others butt and will do everything they can to protect what they have. The problem is not with the ATA, the problem is THE LEADERSHIP. The current leadership is firmly entrenched, from the top down, and to try to change it would take a enormous amount of time over many years, and that just won't do. The ATA cannot survive if it takes much longer. If you, or anyone else, has a way to get them out immediately, a new organization may just be the only alternative. I'm willing to try anything, but, even if every member was given a letter to submit a vote of confidence demanding the resignation of some of the EC/BOD, what good would it do, and who would you submit it to?

 

I apologize for the last 4 words, I cannot remove them, I tried

GB...............DLS

 

Roger... George Cook has just that program, it's called 3S. It records all the scores shot at a registered shoot while it does the cashiering. All those scores are then transmitted to a central point that keeps the records. That would be one of the paid administration jobs.... A magazine it totally not required. All shoot dates, programs, and shoot results would be posted on the new organizations website, just as the PITA does now. Check out www.shootpita.com and see what how they do it....

 

Just curious, let's say the new org. is up and running. And has nothing to do with the ATA. How would you handicap a person? I can understand someone who has never shot and putting them on the 22 +- yd. But how about a long yardage ATA shooter as an example?
Would you check out his yardage using his ATA #?

 

Known ability,

 

Rookieshooter... You would be handicapped to your longest yardage in whatever organizations you belong to. If, let's say, you are classified a 25yd shooter in the PITA and a 27yd shooter in the ATA you would automatically be classified 27yd. in the new organization. Basically, if I'm understanding Gary correctly, the new organization would be pretty much the same as the ATA just run by different people. The shooting rules would pretty much remain the same, just taking better care of the membership and the basic political structure would be changed. Target speeds and angles may be returned to the old way to get the game back where it was, but, most things would remain the same. One thing I would strongly recommend would be that all registered shoots be money shoots. A club could have a set of buckles on hand to give out if a winning shooter of an event wanted a buckle instead of cash, but we really need to put the money back into the game if we want to draw more shooters. Calcutta's need to be returned to registered shoots, even if they have to be held "off site." Most shooters need money to help offset the cost of shooting registered targets. Buckles, trophies, trinkets, etc. do not help foot the bill for shooting trap. If we also did away with a lot of the useless classes that have been added over the past few years, there would be more money to put into the purse making the payout larger. If the new organization makes the targets a little more difficult, as it was in the old days, a winning score for a handicap may be a 95-96. That score is doable for almost all shooters that shoot their earned handicap yardage and would add greatly to drawing more shooters to playing the options..... There are any number of things that can be done to rejuvenate interest is our sport. People go to the casinos to win MONEY. That must be the reason so many casinos are doing so well and are, for the most part, packed with people. Let's face it: If there were two shoots being held the same weekend and you could attend either one, which one would you shoot, the club that gave money as trophies or the club that gives out cheap buckles, etc? Just one example of how things could be changed... Just my opinion

 

Trap2, If most of the ATA clubs started setting machines to 3 hole (it's legal anyway), and implemented other changes that the shooters want, what would the ATA do, not much they can do as this would show what the people want, clubs need to get together with each other (contact/talk), if hundreds of clubs got on the same page the ATA would not remove their affiliation, something to think about.

 

DBrevit,

ATA as an organization would have no issue with clubs doing that at their shoots, perfectly legal. That's been pointed out here adnauseam , but seems most posters feel clubs won't actually do it. Remember, ATA gives us wide latitude in running our shoots and designing our programs. We can throw 3 hole targets, we can use any categories we want, or none at all, etc, etc.

Just need to have someone actually do it if that's what everybody wants.

 

Let me see if I am understanding what you are proposing. If I go to a shoot that has 70 shooters in the singles (which is a fairly well attended ATA shoot in my area) at $25.00/shooter and for simplicity sake, we do a 5 class pay out and all the classes are evenly distributed, meaning there are 14 shooters in each class, and we have $3.00 per shooter returned, each class would pay the winner $42.00? Is that enough to get people to shoot it? I'm not saying that "awards" are the answer, I just believe that paying out cash isn't the answer either. Especially since we know there will be days that there will be only 30 shooters and there is not going to be an even split in the classes and there will be short classes that will barely pay the winner his entry fee back much less the cost of ammo and transportation. Not to mention the Vets, juniors, ladies etc. that may be less likely to attend if they are not recognized. I am not any of the category shooters and don't agree with ALL the categories the ATA has introduced but do agree that there should be some kind of recognition of them.

 

So somebody needs to start a club section on the forum were they can talk, compare notes and encourage each other to stay on the program, if not this subject will just go around and around like a dog chasing it's tail to no end.

 

If you want to see what some people do not like about the "ATA", it is easy.

Go spend 40k on a camper, 50k on a truck to pull it, 15k for a shotgun, 100 bucks a flat for shells, spend days and weeks away from home, then spend a few thousand on "entry-fees", and so on ......

Then return home to your family, and try to explain why it was necessary to invest all that time and money for a 40 dollar "lewis" check and a plastic duck. Until you do this ... YOU MAY NEVER understand why some feel so STRONG about the "ATA problems".

If ... your wife wants you to keep doing it ... she may have a "boyfriend" to take your place while you are gone.

Shooting "ATA" on a local level to hack your way to a "27-yard card" with non-competitive scores to impress your friends is OK for some, but the "problems" are for those who took it to the next level.

So ... step-up and take your swing at it ... then you can join the "bashing" threads with how you beat the odds, and all the thousands of wasted dollars were a "good investment".

 

User1 , who are you addressing your post to ?

 

XTshooter... In all fairness, each singles class shoots for its own money and the handicaps are short, mid, and long yardage with all the money going into one purse and paid out, say, 3 places, or whatever the club wants. I, personally, would like to do away with the vet class, the senior classes (I am a senior), ladies class, junior classes, etc. and all the other "make me feel good" classes. Look at all these singles classes now. All the winners of these various classes at any major, or mid sized shoot can win a singles event if there are only 5 classes. All the monies from those classes are now distributed into the 5 classes left to increase the purse, and the purse is not diluted. The purse can be paid out high gun or percentage. There are many different ways to do it..... Handicap is much simpler. ALL the money goes into one purse and everybody shoots for their share of it. If a shooter wants to be competitive at his yardage, he would have to take a reduction if he is eligible. This was the way it was done years ago when trapshooting was in its hey day. I am more in favor of paying the handicap purse on a percentage system, but that's just the way I like it.... All these things would have to be decided and agreed upon if, and when, a new organization was available. We all can come up with as many reasons it would work as we do that it won't work. The real problem is it's not working now so why not change it? You know the old saying "If you always do what you've always done, you will always get what you always got".

 

"In all fairness, each singles class shoots for its own money and the handicaps are short, mid, and long yardage with all the money going into one purse and paid out, say, 3 places, or whatever the club wants."
With all due respect I believe that is what I said. "$3.00 per shooter returned, each class would pay the winner $42.00? Is that enough to get people to shoot it?" I am not disagreeing with you in that the "awards" are what people want to shoot for but I also don't think there is any money in it for the club to pay out. I think if people want to shoot for money that is what the purse, lewis, options and calcuttas are for and the awards are what the club can afford to add to it. Especially if there aren't many shooters! The major shoots would have the numbers to support added money or something of that sort to get the money back in to it. I think the same logic applies to the handicap yardage groups as the singles.

I am not passing judgement on the ATA or the ITA, just trying to figure out what would work best to get more shooters to come to my club and shoot targets, spend money and support our efforts.

 

To the few posters above, it's a recreational sport/hobby for most people, like playing golf on the weekend, do people expect the club to give them money for playing a good round, if the cost of 4 boxes of shells and $20 for targets is to much it may be time to stop, what happened to just doing something because you enjoy doing it.
If it's not a hobby/pastime then the shooting sports are the wrong place if you think of making money.
ATA the first A , amateur, should be the first sign that the ability to make money is low, otherwise it would be PTA = Pro Trapshooting Association ( pro golf, pro tennis, pro football, pro basketball) and for Pro you need industry and media, the shooting sports are not great spectator sports that does not help things. Shoot because you enjoy shooting and the challenge of doing the best you can.

 

Many clubs here have money for trophies. The shooter is guaranteed $50 for the winner of each class, $50ea to the short, mid, and long yardage winner and $75 for handicap champion. In this case, the club puts up this money as a trophy and all the money collected for the fees for that shoot goes in to satisfying that package. Anything they make beyond that is gross profit for the club. If you add the Lewis, 2 man blind draw, magnum purses,calcuttas, etc. the shooter has many ways to win and can hit a nice payday for shooting well. Just as an example, a very small club I'm going to shoot next week end has over $10,000 in their magnum purse. That's right, a small 4 trap club in a town that has a very low population has this much money available. Hit any one of those 50's and you walk away with half of what is in that 50. Does a shoot like this get my attention? You bet it does. That's why I'm going. As I said, there are lots of ways to do it.

 

Why not take a vote. That is have the life members put up a slate
Of competent members who would be willing to start the ATA up and
Running legally and honestly and above board. If necessary go back
And ask for resignations and have a membership vote.
In other words clean house completely if that is the way to go.
I'm sure we still have many existing officers who meet the
Qualifications and many other who could.
Purchase nothing without bids, not because of friendship or other
Shady ways.
Buy from legit businesses not under the table dealings

And let the membership know what is happening and not leave us
Guessing.

The trophy situation sure needs a good revamping. Shooters no longer
Want to go home with junk.I have seen many hit the gun club trash
Cans or get left at the clubs!

Greta c

 

Remember folks, it was the club operators themselves that drove the change from 44 degree angles to 34 degree angles. Originally that intent was to attract some of the well known All-Americans to pad their averages with an easier target! That was during the time averages was used to select All-Americans and not the "point system" used today. That cheating cancer spread all across the country in short order!

As BAT pointed out above, 44 degree angles are still legally set targets for registering with ATA. That would seem to imply these would be the same as targets of old but it certainly isn't! Why? Because of the current speed limits (distance rule) when setting ATA targets couldn't possibly be the same as target settings back when our sport was growing by leaps and bounds! That's the same reasons the "experiment" year was a flop also when we finally adopted the cheating practice as the best thing for our sport in years. Was it? Not according to our growth numbers it wasn't.

As stated above, we don't have an ATA problem at all, we had and currently have a severe lack of leadership that wants what's best for our sport! When our own ATA officials have no regard for our rules in target settings why should anyone else? Why have a rule book if it's not enforced to a "T"?

Yes, it's high time our sport was run with honor and integrity, from the top down to an individual member. Our setting rules were monkeyed with at last years Grand American also, I know first hand, I shot them. I watched each and every bank of traps I was to shoot on is how I know! Straights from posts 1 and 5 are 44 degree angles. Two traps set at 44 and two set at 34 makes for an interesting day in handicaps. I watched a few All-Americans bewildered for a trap or two in addition when they shot scores in the teens!

HAP

 

How on earth does the club make money to stay in business ?

 

I fixed it

 

We already have a shooting sport that emphasizes trinkets for all who participate and whose participants balk at putting up .25/man-it's called skeet. When Trapshooting was the finest game in town shooters liked to gamble on their ability and large purses and prizes were the norm. ATA policies ruined that portion of the game and chased the money players over to the casinos. As in many sports some people regard them as strictly hobby while others prefer an ROI-to each his own.

That said states are building more and more casinos so please don't tell us people do not like to gamble!

 

I seen where Mike Hampton may be the one to lead the ATA after all of the smoke clears. If he is tapped for the job then the new organization must be instituted. He ruined the game of Skeet we can not let him kill the game of TRAP. If the state of ILL. places him in charge of the Sparta complex it is doomed. Roger C.

 

If they left, they had no real interest in the sport, just hustling(gamble on their ability, as you put it). I'm not for giving everyone a trophy, to much of that going around . I'm not against winning some cash, what I said was the shooting sports are not a place to make a living for 99.5% of people. If you want to gamble pay your shoot fee then put $100 in the pot (side bet) best shooter takes it all.

If the ATA would stop pandering (it does not work in the long run), get rid of a bunch of sub categories, be more industry friendly, expenses only management, go to 1920's rules and STICK with them , no Lewis, you win by performance not because you showed up and got lucky, then the ATA may have the funds to give good prizes.

On another subject, the ATA should have purchased land and built it's home base facility years ago, that location would then have been the" Grand " location every year, would then make sense for a HOF and be on it's home turf, would not have to deal with politics .

 

So you're getting rid of many categories and the associated trinkets. Can't say it's a bad idea but what should we replace them with to draw shooters? Since you're against money playing and named the Lewis class as your first casualty you should realize the Lewis is the most played option and used to average around 50% players. Putting down $100 in the handicap against Harlan C. wouldn't make much sense-would it?

Are they shutting down all the casinos because people gave up gambling-it sure doesn't look like it. Maybe they gave up gambling in Trapshooting because even fools know a sucker bet!!

 

oleolliedawg, what's with you and casino's. Casino's did not cause the problems I'm reading about with the ATA.
If you are shooting the same handicap as Harlan at the same event you can't run away, put your $100 in, why not, it's a gamble, right.

 

So your idea is simply charging shooters extra $$ for the honor of shooting ATA targets, getting their name in some obscure book, eliminating options and prizes and the ATA will flourish again. Why?

All this knowledge coming from a new member joining in 2016. Tell us more about how to make the ATA shooting a success again. Inquiring minds are listening!

 

oleolliedawg,
Your disdain for ATA is obvious , as I noted above" the problems I'm reading about", there are pages of them, one can form an opinion, just because I just joined does not indicate that I have not been involved or have no knowledge of, maybe to fix it, new blood with none-jaded views need to get involved in the sport, I could be mistaken on the last one. I said above if the ATA stops wasting money they could afford to spend money on good prizes if that's all that matters.

It would be nice to have a real name so I know who I'm talking to, also if we are at the same shoot in the coming year I know who to bet with, say $1,000, should be a safe bet for you I'm new 2016.

 

I could use a spare $1,000. See me at the FL State shoot and bring cash!

 

And the name is ? how can I make a bet and shake hand on it (with cash in pocket) when I don't know who it is ? Heck I'll even use my side by side.

 

Ok guys, this is an interesting thread. Like to hear some more Pros/Cons. As my own thoughts on the subject. I'm an adrenaline driven junkie. Raced many types of race cares before ever joining ATA back in the 70's. I thrive on competition. Got out of shooting clay targets back in 86 cause I found other things to do. Just joined up again late summer of 2015. In fact just sold my last competitive race vehicle only 2 years ago, qff- road machine. Sorry for all the brag, but if this knew org. does not set it up to be highly competitive and more for a venue for a bunch of tea toddlers to chat. Then I would not even walk across the street to shoot. In fact back in the early seventies Trap & Field even mentioned the adrenaline rush I got from winning races to winning some trap shooting events. At 68 you'd think I would slow down....BS. So Gary and friends, I hope you put the competitive part on the front burner and not the back.
On a side note: Went to a shoot few months ago when the club manager told me, Rick I like you as a friend, but when I walk to that line, I come to take your money....Gotta Love that guy

 

For an extra $1,000 I'll even put the wife in on this bet. I hope you enjoy getting beat by a woman too!

Unfortunately for you you'll have to move quite a bit from your 20 yd. line to the 27 and outside your comfort zone!

 

Thank You

GB................DLS

 

DAN THOME TRAP 2: I have been thinking about the 2 SATELLITE GRANDS One on the East Coast and One on the West Coast.
They would be 2 big shoots MONEY SHOOTS Like the Old Harrahs Club. where you could win a CAR,, I would like to see a Program from that Era, The big Shoots at RENO NEVADA, Sponsored by the CASINO's, We now have lots of CASINO's on both COASTS, We need to get Sponsors, to put up Money, Auto Mfgrs to put up Cars, They do not need to be BIG EXPENSIVE CARS!!!! Also Gun Manufacturers putting up Trapguns, These would be Big Drawing Cards, I THINK!!!!!!! GREAT IDEAS BRING GREAT SHOOTS.

SATTELITE GRANDS MAY BE THE WRONG NAME THOUGH

Gary Bryant.......................Dr.longshot

 

Gary,
Sorry for the drift of your thread, to start a new organization you have your work cut out, it will take a lot of money and time, you will need a lot of help across the country to make it worth doing, have your rules and intent and stick with them. Figure what it will cost and double it, make a list of help and figure a 70% can't really help, the list goes on.

Take a hard look at what is really involved, not just wishful thinking.

Post your final draft of the rules and mission statement.

Wish you luck

 

Gary.... Browning donated 3 new guns to the PITA as prizes for the Grand.... See the entire grand program from last year here http://issuu.com/shootpita/docs/2015_grand_pacific_front_page-2/3?e=16948008/12587562 In the past, several gun mfgrs and ammo mfgrs have donated to the PITA, and were very generous in doing so...

 

I had a friend that insisted we bet a buck on each trap score and another on the total of each handicap we shot. This bet ran until he passed away and I doubt if there was more then a buck or two difference between our profits. It gave us something to look forward to and bragging rights until the next shoot. Worked for us!

 

You may need both barrels.

Dave Berlet

 

Maybe, but like I posted above, Gary's post is going off track and should not.

 

Yup, and the wife's name is Tammy Hensel ATA # 9701959. Now about that extra $1,000?

Maybe you should start with a little side bet you just might have a chance of winning. Tommy Hensel ATA #1518589. He's still at your yardage and at 9 yo still needs some seasoning but who knows!

 

You assume way to much based on me just joining ATA (reason for the yardage), very wrong to bring your 9 year old into this.

 

Heh, I'm not greedy and always willing to give someone a chance. You'd better hurry up as those of us on here who know little Tommy also know he shoots his K-80 pretty well!

 

As I have mentioned before, never count the Hensels out, & I mean all
Four of them.
The youngest son is going to be aaa27Aaa before we know what's happening.

With his parents as coaches. He can't fail.

Happy new year to everybody from Greta and Jack
P.S.. Jack' grandson J.C.D 111 is well on his way to be AA27AA. He is getting there at a rapid pace.



Andy ran a very successful gun club for years!

 

I'm sure little Tommy and JCD III will be going at it real soon. Let the best man (kid) win. Looks like we'll be getting a few extra thousand $$ for our FL trip this Spring. As always, we'll look forward to seeing both of you.

Happy New Year to all from Andy, Tammy and Tommy!

 

Dawg... if you need a neutral party to hold the cash or judge/watch the shoot off... I'll offer up my services since I'll be parked on the front line again this year.

Jerry B

 

I'd love to be your judging assistant since I'll be there watching!!
And I'm a qualified, honest and honorable, unpredudist, impartial
Person. Except that I have known the Hensels for oodles of years!

Greta c

 

I think Mr Brevit went back to the pistol shooting world which he excels at. That said, I think it would be a great match-him with his old sxs and 2 shots and me with a bit of experience from the 27 yd. line and 1 shot. If that's not enough I'll sic Tammy on 'em from the measly 16 yd. line and that spare $1.000 will buy us a few dinners this Spring in FL!!